Danny Cipriani talks about past troubles


Just how fast is Carlin Isles?


Streaker starts mass brawl after tackle


Sam Burgess breaks cheekbone, plays on


Step and unbelievable dummy sets up try


Lee Jones makes huge trysaving tackle


The Human Hurdle Attempt


Springboks edge All Blacks in thriller


Benito Masilevu's huge side-steps

Wednesday, April 09, 2008

Martin Johnson defiant prematch against Ireland 2003

Martin Johnson defiant prematch against Ireland 2003

Known for his strong leadership and no-nonsense approach to the game, 2003 World Cup winning Captain of England Martin Johnson was often perceived as the bad guy by the opposition.

Never more so than at Landsdowne Road five years ago when shortly before kick-off against Ireland, Johnson broke protocol by refusing to move to the red carpet parade area, resulting in President of Ireland, Mary McAleese, having to walk across the uncovered grass to him instead.

Much media attention was made of this, and the Daily Telegraph hypothesized a scenario of the outcry should a similar snub be made to the Queen of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland by an Irish captain. Johnson never publicly apologised.

Johnson maintains he was not at fault and had not received special pre-match instructions despite being asked three times to move.

The Irish Rugby Football Union apologised to the Irish President on his behalf.

Posted at 12:52 pm | 78 comments

Viewing 78 comments

Tom April 09, 2008 12:25 pm

Ignorant fool, still thinks its the 1800's. He should have had his head kicked in. Ireland would never be so ignorant to the 'Queen', and we have a reason.........Tiocfaidh ar la

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davo April 09, 2008 12:26 pm

well doe rd. interesting bit of footage.why arent there more nutters like johnson playing captain these days? they all seem a bit clean cut to me.

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will66 April 09, 2008 12:53 pm

Tom,I don't think it was specifically a bit of anti-Irishness, I think Johnson would have done the same no matter what country England were playing that day. It was about winning the Grand Slam, not politics.Personally I hope Johnson brings a similar stubborn, hard-nosed attitude to the current lot when he (eventually) becomes manager. They certainly need the mental edge that Johnson's era had.

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BossHogg April 09, 2008 12:54 pm

Ah baws Greifel,what have you done posting this?? Now we're going to get a pile of baws about, how poor done the Irish are and wasn't it a terrible slur etc etc yada yada. Nice to see that Tom has already got into the swing of it. Judging by the comments on you tube, i give it a few more days before, we get some "oh that would never have happened at Croke Park" followed by "the dirty tan bastard".Which will then be countered by accusations of families being blown up in car bombs in Armagh, Germany, Brixton etc. Finally you'll get some threat from the depths of the internet stating "i know where you live" and "i'll have you done" Still as Neil Francis succinctly put it on the "this disrespect to Mary McAlese is utter bullshit"Still the english haven't won against the Irish since. So maybe a bit of justice in the end.Bosshogg

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monk April 09, 2008 12:58 pm

Cowardly out of BOD, should have stood infront of them I remember watching that and knew staight away that england would win the game

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 1:04 pm

what prick.

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Eric April 09, 2008 1:10 pm

As the commentator said, its sport psycology...

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 1:40 pm

This is matt by the way i dont have a google name.it may not be about irish politics but it was very poor behaviour by johnson he iss like a two year old child, it really makes me ashamed to be english, so dissapointed in him he had such a good career otherwise. shame on you johnson.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 2:04 pm

same old england...it takes a while to get used to your neighbour's freedom after 800 years of rape,pillage and oppression.it worked, mind

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Cheyanqu April 09, 2008 2:08 pm

Martin Johnson is an evil genius.In some ways, he's reminiscent of a Gordie Howe hat trick (1 goal, 1 assist, 1 fight) or a Mark Messier (esp. the thick, almost simian brow)All this aside, if he really did piss people off this much, why didn't some no-name player take it upon himself to simply eliminate Johnson from future rugby?Jeez it seems that in 2007 Bayonne had no problem trying to "soften up" BOD for the Les Bleus.Put a boot to his head, etc. I am not condoning it. But if your guys are going to play dirty against England, go for their best players, not some hack (Federico Mendez, are you listening?)

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Phil April 09, 2008 2:23 pm

Did it work though? From the BBC website: "Aiming for a first Grand Slam in 55 years, Ireland were quickest out of the blocks." England won out in the end, and handily, but the aim was surely to unsettle Ireland's start, and that does not appear to have happened.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 3:18 pm

and the english wonder why people call them arrogant pricks??thats english sport at its slimeiest!!!!

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Rancid April 09, 2008 3:22 pm

The president of Ireland is a pain in the arse anyway. Don't know why she doesn't fuck off and leave rugby alone, she's boring.As for people saying they wouldn't do the same to the Queen. The Queen doesn't repeatedly pro-long kick offs by invading every rugby match England participates in for the sake of stroking her own ego.Though i doubt any English would care if you did disrespect our Queen. Being that she's a waste of space and nothing more than a tourist attraction.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 3:32 pm

It was a shameful incident. Its one thing to say he wasnt told where to stand but when refusing to move after being asked a number of times shows a great level of disrespect for our President.Sports psychology my hole. Perhaps we'll burn the English flag in the centre of the pitch next year and say "Ah its just sports psychology". A line has to be drawn somewhere between what happens on and off the pitch. All I can say is the Irish team and people would never stoop so low. Indeed we covered ourselves in glory and dignity with the huge respect given to "God Save the Queen" in Croke Park in the 2007 6N.All this incident did was to sully the reputation of Martin Johnson, one of the games great players.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 3:33 pm

hahaha, Martin Johnson best in the business

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rancid April 09, 2008 3:39 pm

Anonymous, the difference is the English don't care if you did the same to our primeminister, because our primeminister is a tit.And a newsflash for you and the Irish population, your President is a cunt too.Don't you Irish follow politics?The equivelant of your reactions would be like Americans getting upset because someone did this to Bush. It's laughable.It's an action that should be applauded. Your president is only a pawn after all. It isn't an attack on Ireland, or the Irish, or your culture. Merely an attack on your CORRUPT leader.

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angus April 09, 2008 3:48 pm

What quite a few people dont relise on this site is that people are in there own zone before a match and type of stupid protocol should get in there way. Johnson and the rest were never told wat side to be on.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 4:14 pm

This is why England is the best god damn country in the WORLD. Go Martin Johnson!!!!!!!!!!!

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Dave April 09, 2008 4:40 pm

People are taking this waaay too seriously, this wasnt Martin Johnsons way of dissing Ireland, this was showing that England were strong and wouldnt be pushed around. Bit hard-nosed, but id rather have that attitude than a nice guy. Thats what made Johnno such a legend, he really had a no-nonense, cut-the-crap way of leading things.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 4:53 pm

rancid, ur talkin bullshit! if you follow irish politics so closely, name one event where our president has shown herself to be a "cunt" or to be "corrupt". and as for delaying kick-off one of the princes or some royal always meets the players bfore the english games too, and too right, its part of rugby tradition. as for this incident, johnson is a legend, did drico really expect him to just move over? it wasnt about politics, it was about johnson showing that england werent goin to back down on the day. its rugby rancid, keep politics out of it, especially when u havent a clue

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Rancid April 09, 2008 5:26 pm

Keep politics out? That's what i'm trying to do, you fool.Keeping politics out would be keeping corrupt and scummy political figures off of the ground.And i'm not going to write an essay on why the Irish president is a vile human being. There is no point, because if you can't see it now you never will.The same way i wouldn't give a Bush or Brown lover reasons why Bush or Brown are dickheads; because they'd simply neglect the truth i present.Bottom line is this wasn't an attack on the Irish, it was simply a lack of respect for a political figure who deserves no respect in the first place. So there's no logical reason for Irish people to get mad.

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webby April 09, 2008 5:47 pm

My god lets not start on politics....all it was, was pure and simple but very affective psychology, mind games and intimidation, which is a part of the game!

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Fred April 09, 2008 5:49 pm

As has been said, it was not a respect issue - its the fact that most players see the pre match stuff as rubbish that adds needless time between team talks and getting in the zone when changing, and the kick off. When the players leave the room, most are ready to smash someone - so i can see exactly why Johnson would not be bothered where he stands - he is thinking about his first tackle, not if someone has to get a little mud on their feet. Blown out of all proportion.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 6:24 pm

rancid, you are retarded. you're obviously one of those idiots who knows nothing about anything and yet you shoot his mouth off about it in spite of the fact that your opinion is worthless to everyone as you are clearly woefully uninformed. for starters our president is not the equivalent of george bush or gordon brown, she is merely a figurehead who has little or no effect on matters of public policy. our equivalent to bush and brown is the taoiseach who is arguably very corrupt but he doesn't delay rugby games so it's not really a matter for discussion here.Johnson's clearly a knob for doing this, BOD is a knob for not making more of it. would have been interesting to see how things would've gone if the Irish team stood in front of them.

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AbbyNo7 April 09, 2008 6:54 pm

Johnson stood on that side as that was the side that England would have been defending in the first half. He meant no disrespect to the President. He didn't move, that was purely psychological nothing else. They were making a statement and nothing else. It is in the past now. And if England did that at a Scotland game with Princess Anne coming out i wouldn't be "oh arrogant English", i'd be saying fair play to them, show some mettle. Johnson is anything but the arrogant Englishman, remember Will Carling?

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Sharky April 09, 2008 7:04 pm

Interesting clip, I hadn't seen that before. Pity you morons turn it into a political debate when it's clearly about rugby psychology, which worked in the end with England taking the Grand Slam. Johnson was a bit of a doos about it though.. and if you don't know what a doos is... google it.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 7:21 pm

anon who said this was not psychology is extremely misguided!England stood where they did, mistake or not, they were the first there and so took position! for them to have moved would have shown them backing down and being submissive to Ireland before KO. Johnson is extremely clever and knew that his lads having to shift for them might not have much of a difference but by telling the Irish that he wouldnt budge it showed everyone one of them that if they didnt back down the Irish would have to acccomodate them!*sorry about the length of the post but i felt the comment needed a sufficient response.

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Dave April 09, 2008 7:30 pm

hahahahaha i'm both english and irish but that's just to funny :P

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 8:26 pm

Rancid, I could rabbit on about how utterly wrong you are, but I'll keep it short, that way you might understand me. You are a twat. Go Wikipedia your claims before you insult your excuse for intelligence any further.

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Anonymous April 09, 2008 8:54 pm

good on him

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elrolo April 09, 2008 9:13 pm

iv read his biography, he says that he was never told what side to stand on. So when he got there he was hardly ever going to move, it would make England look like mugs.

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Third Centre April 09, 2008 9:35 pm

there are actually going to be so many stupid comments on this that its going to be unral. What johnson did was wrong. the etiquette for playing in Landsdowne has always been the same, the away team stand on one side and the home team on the other. It has always been that way ans i'm pretty sure all other grounds have a similar policies. Johns made a mistake and then wouldn't back down.It was a disgrace and very very poor sportsmanship. However I think it was disgraceful of the IRFU to accept it and the irish team should have stood in front of them. The comment about the Irish president is pretty funny. How can you get angry at her ? I mean really ... End of discussion one of English rugby's most embarassing moments. Let that be the end of it

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No.7 April 09, 2008 11:04 pm

I think "Bosshogg" has made the best comment regarding whats to come, as i scroll down i already see some anonymous prick with "and the english wonder why people call them arrogant pricks??thats english sport at its slimeiest!!!!"Well tbh the rest of the comments really bored me, i think you should all appreciate this kind of footage and these things happening, at least it gives half of you something to bitch about for 5 mins in your meaningless lives.

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Florian April 10, 2008 10:05 am

I remember english grand slam in 2003.Great team! Rosbeefs had the scrum,the will and WilkinsonI didn't remember of that. That's quite arrogant...a bit "old england"I'm not fond of protocol but it's a question of respect, whatever if it was just "mental". a bit "touchy" when know irish-english friendship..I prefer when it's on the pitch, men to men:France vs all blacks haka RWC 2007Ireland vs all blacks haka in the 90's (or 80's) in lansdowne roadLewsey slapping traille's head RWC 2007

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PZ April 10, 2008 1:16 pm

If Johnson had done the same in a cup final for Leicester against Wasps would people be calling it treason? I don't think so. He simply didn't want to back down and as Shane Horgan says 'Lose face'. I love the way it's pissed off every Irish man who watched it. That is some powerful rugby psychology.And what's all this about the English being arrogant? Haven't heard that before!!! May be it's because England have been world cup finalist twice in a row. What have the Irish got to be arrogant about? Nothing. That's why they are always humble in defeat.Surely if it's arrogance you're after how about the ABs, Aussies, SA, France, Wales?

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Andy April 10, 2008 1:36 pm

I think it's bloody excellent behaviour!!! Nothing against the irish just wasn't going to be pushed around so close to kick off when he was thinking about the massive game. Chill everyone.

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Carts7 April 10, 2008 1:45 pm

Hahaha Jog on ladies jog on.Deal with it for gods sake. Its obvious it wasnt a political reason and the insecurities of some people who think it is, is also clear.Alls fair in love and war etc etc therefore move on and dry your eyes, both English and Irish bloggers.

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thedannyclayton April 10, 2008 2:36 pm

To the angry 'anon'"for starters our president is not the equivalent of george bush or gordon brown, she is merely a figurehead who has little or no effect on matters of public policy."So why give a shit then? Figurehead with muddy Gucci shoes; Oh fucking dear. Maybe you are pissed off because you've wasted your best players in 50 years...

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mat n April 10, 2008 3:37 pm

haha all the people trying to call english people arrogant pricks and whatever, My opinion is that it was physchologically a brilliant move it got everyone worked up and it is true, he would have done it to anyone. Stuff like that is what made him such a great captain.ps to anyone who left an anonymous comment after writing a offensive comment to MJ or English people in general, at least have the balls to say your name don't be such a ***** in the future if you want to say something at least say it properly

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Anonymous April 10, 2008 4:01 pm

"Figurehead with muddy Gucci shoes"This is pobably the most homosexual msg on the internet, what a wanker!Matt

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No.7 April 10, 2008 4:59 pm

Well done matt, i suppose we shouldnt really listen to anything you say seeing as you have no idea how to put your name in the "Name/URL" section.ITS NOT HARD GUYS!!! you scroll down and click the anonymous tab, why not go up one from anonymous and stick a nickname or a name in! GEEEEZ you want someone to make a fucking video about it?!!?Sorry RD! great video!!

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iceman! April 10, 2008 5:28 pm

ahahah its so funny reading all of these wimpish comments on here.fact is if Johnson wasnt told where to stand, then thats the organiser's (and NOT the Irish's!) fault. Before you're playing England's biggest game in about 8 years you want to be totally in the zone, and not saying 'oh I beg your pardon madam, I am sorry for standing 20 metres from where I should be'. It's a piece of grass she had to walk over for f*ck sake, not a pile of horse manure.Besides, England still appeared on the left hand side of the Irish, what are the complaints?

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Anonymous April 10, 2008 7:12 pm

makes me laugh wen the irish say the english or martin johnson is an arrogant prick when BOD is the biggest arrogant prick 2 ever grace a rugby pitch

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Hamish M April 10, 2008 8:54 pm

Deliberate? Nah.However, Johnson always was one to stick to his guns. He was a real man. Why the fuck should he have moved just because 'protocol' said that he should. The Irish should just have stood on the English side.Anyway, in response to the first post; this isn't like lacking respect for the Queen, it's like lacking respect for the Prime Minister - and I couldn't care less about that. On the other hand, if someone made QEII walk on the grass...

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DJKK April 10, 2008 10:01 pm

^BOD is one of the most arrogant pricks to grace a rugby field?Ben Cohen, so arrogant even English people don't like him.Still it's a tradition. You don't walk up and break up the Haka so you can take the kick off. You would think someone decent would respect tradition, especially as the English do kind of owe the Irish in the tradition department, having ground their culture into nothing.Martin Johnson - Fat, ugly, typical English meat-head.

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Anonymous April 10, 2008 10:11 pm

read my post again i didnt say cohen wasnt arrogant, but hes not as arrogant as BOD as showed against new zealand and as dealt with well by new zealand!'Martin Johnson - Fat, ugly, typical English meat-head'.compared 2 the typical irish person, small, scrawny, pikey

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Pedro Fleury April 11, 2008 1:02 am

Johnson - disrespectful ... over the line.BOD - PUSSY! should have stood in front of them! would have been a massive game if they had done that

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thedannyclayton April 11, 2008 9:21 am

"Figurehead with muddy Gucci shoes"This is pobably the most homosexual msg on the internet, what a wanker!MattEh? She was clearly trying to stroke her own overpaid ego. So all I was saying was that she might get he expensive shoes muddy which is basically what the fuss was about.Matt you are a fool.

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Third Centre April 11, 2008 9:57 am

This is actually hilarious. All this vitriol against Irish people and Mary MacAleese ? Where's it coming from lads ?She is the figurehead of a country and therefore deserves comparable respect to that of a Queen, PM or president ? If you actually can't see that and think she is on a lower level to other world leaders then,although your entitled to your opinion, you are completely lacking in respect for other people and their culture. Whoever said it would be different if it happened to QE is completely wrong.I understand completely why Johnson acted as he did but it doesn't make it right and shows him in a very poor light . However he showed disrespect to the President of my country, a woman of great humility and dignity. So do not expect Irish people not to be angry about this. Particularly as it was done by the captain of England, a country with which we have had a long time setting right over how to treat us.oh and what did BOD do in NZ that was arrogant ?

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iceman! April 11, 2008 10:50 am

my point is it would have been disrepectful if Jonno had deliberately walked out on that side. He maintains he was not told where to go, and he doesnt bullshit. therefore why should he have to move - the last thing he would be thinking about before the kick off would be paying respects to some PM.If it was so disrespectful for the PM to be made o walk on the mud, then why didnt the Irish line up on the other side? It seems they don't care too much about the PM's muddy feet either...

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mat n April 11, 2008 10:54 am

politics... on a rugby site?also, how is MJ fat?

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Third Centre April 11, 2008 12:56 pm

I think the comment was fat-head....but i digress. For the last hundred years or so in Landsdowne road the away international team always stands on one side. Its the same the world over. Johnson made a mistake and wouldn't admit to it. No one had to tell him beforehand because its part of playing international rugby. Its like not standing for the other teams anthem. I'm sure you're not told to do it before you go out onto the pitch, you just know.Ireland had to stand to the left of the away team or they would of have been showing disrespect to the president too. It was the only dignified and classy thing to do. Whats with all the anti-Irish comments ? They didn't do anything wrong in this instance

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Anonymous April 11, 2008 4:23 pm

rancid there is actually something wrong with you. the first comment u made on this page was "The president of Ireland is a pain in the arse anyway". den u say ur trying to keep politics out of it??!!! what a loser

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Anonymous April 11, 2008 4:49 pm

how exactly was BOD arrogant in NZ? i think it's safe to say that any non Irish person who has left a message insulting our president knows precisely fuck all about her or about Irish politics so i would kindly ask you to inform yourself before you make a tit of yourself by posting comments about her here.

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Sharky April 11, 2008 5:29 pm

So whenever a touchy clip is posted, this site is going to turn into a political battlefield? Come on guys, lets keep it about the rugby and view a clip like this as it is - interesting and eye opening. I hate the country vs country arguments and debates. Really childish actually.

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Third Centre April 11, 2008 6:17 pm

Its different for irish people Sharky. We can be a bit sensitive over this stuff. I wish it wasn't the case though

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Ross James April 11, 2008 11:02 pm

Neil Francis: "This disrespect to Mary McAleese is absolute bullshit"Wouldnt expect better from a westbrit cunt like himself. No wonder he could never beat England during his less than impressive playing days.

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Carts7 April 14, 2008 9:27 am

Ok the video was slightly Irish themed, but the point of the video was not Country, Political or person related. I think any true rugby supporter or player can see the reason behind MJ doing what he did, i feel those bloggers coming on to rant about Irish/English issues and making what is the majority of the time a fun, interesting and easy going site, need to have a good look at themsleves and see if rugby really is the sport they love. Everyone is entitled to an opinion and can air it if they choose to, but some comments/opinions shouldnt have been posted and are better left unaired.Huge and possibly pointless/repetitive comment over and out.Get rucked (haha)

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AK April 14, 2008 7:44 pm

Yeah agreed, get over yourselves guys...this is about rugby. The talking point should be about MJ being hard headed. For those who are not sure, he's never dabbled in politics or publicly cast an opinion on anything that's not rugby related. Maybe some of you should follow his example.

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wolonel April 16, 2008 1:16 am

when we all stood up to watch this great game..martin johnson turned it into a sham..he meant it..he's a smart lad..one fine day we will revisit this sham on mister johnson..twill be sweet..non irish rugby lovers should imagine an equivalent disgrace being dumped on their doorstep a la johnson..i don't care if yis all think it's a laugh..i think it's a laugh..life is shit..when you're irish and you love rugby..this stuff makes you want to either go back the gaa..or just bait them 4 in a row..johnson is darth vadar..o'driscoll is luke skywalker..sound lads keep playin the clips

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Anonymous April 16, 2008 8:06 am

Similar tactics of sports psychology/intimidation are used by many sides with NZ being particularly guilty of this. Similarly, the Fijian 7s team are known to ignore organisers requests often resulting in matches starting slightly late, purely to inconvenience the opposition and let them know who is boss.

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Anonymous May 31, 2008 10:41 pm

he knew damn well which side he was supposed to be on (it was always the home side there in landsdowne road) and of course he didn't mean anything political by it, but he still should have moved.would it have made a real difference? i know it's good sports pyschology but it's very rude.and yes the english have a higher opinion of themselves than other races e.g Times headline a few years ago"Fog cuts off continent"The article went on to explain how Europe wouldn't be able to function properly because of the loss of connection to Britain for a few days.It maintained that Britain would be unaffected.

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Anonymous July 06, 2008 2:16 pm

I think that if Ireland's 22 had stood face to face with England's and said "We're not moving until you do", it would have been a very different atmosphere.

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Andy August 05, 2008 3:39 pm

"SHould have his head kicked in" - by you and 4 of your friends - have a good time trying!He was just winding the Irish and it worked. BOD should have made more of it - who remembers the Irish facing the haka arm in arm - Norm Hewitt almost kicking off - now that was an Irish team people respected.Johnson will bring that steel and "F## you" character back to the men in white - about bloody time too.

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Richard August 05, 2008 11:31 pm

Why is everyone getting so hyped up about it? I'm Irish and I think what he did was genius. I got under our skin and that's what he wanted to do. If our players wanted to 'counter' it they would have just stood in front of them and told 'em to fuck off. Martin Johnson will be good for England I think. He's that type of person that with regards to rugby has a fuck you attitude but he seems like a nice gut off it.

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F August 07, 2008 8:49 am

This will have been Woodward's idea.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 12:10 am

Its funny looking back at the comments, Johnson has proved to be a failure. Only the English would do something like that.

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mattn December 08, 2008 8:59 pm

Shut up m8 (above and any1 else that slaggs of england)

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Anonymous December 10, 2009 7:44 am

Good Afternoon!!! rugbydump.blogspot.com is one of the most outstanding informational websites of its kind. I take advantage of reading it every day. All the best.

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Will December 12, 2009 5:45 pm

Epitomised Johnson's time as a captain. England were successful but without any class or style.

Not a patch on Pienaar, Nick Farr-Jones et al.

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Anonymous March 01, 2010 3:34 pm

well well i tell u what goes around comes back and smacks u right on ur big fat ignorant head MJ, ireland have won the last 6 out of 7 games against england who havent won a anything since the world cup. by the way good game on the wkend there's nothing better then watching ur chariots crash and BURN!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHA

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Anonymous March 04, 2010 9:03 pm

He's only a wanker!

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neil March 05, 2010 12:05 pm

oh dear marty rubber johnnyson, how the mighty have fallen, you got your grand slam that day but your lack of talent as a manager makes for wonderful viewing, theres an awful stench of shite rugby coming out of twickenham these days, you can stick your fucking chariot up your hole ye big ignorent trophy headed bulls arse!

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Alexander March 07, 2010 12:42 pm

Really, people taking this too seriously. As an Englishman felt MJ shouldn't have done that!! Could be disrespectful ya know!! Ha well Irish are beating us now so maybe the egos are back up!!

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