Monday, November 17, 2008
Australia down England at Twickenham
Matt Giteau, who made his international debut at the same ground in 2002, was in sublime form as he kicked 20 points and pulled off a try-saving tackle. Adam Ashley-Cooper scored a try with Stirling Mortlock converting it as Australia marched to victory.
After the successful win over the Pacific Islanders last weekend, Englands new coach Martin Johnson has tasted defeat for the first time.
"We gave away too many penalties. It's as simple as that. They did not have to do a lot to score and they did not break us," said Johnson.
"The players are disappointed because that was a game they had a good chance to win.
"If you do not have the ball though you cannot impose your physicality on your opponents."
The departure of Danny Cipriani seven minutes before full time, with what looked like a recurrence of his ankle injury, only added to Englands woes.
This clip includes footage of the nice hit that Wallaby Wycliff Palu put in on home shortly before that.
For Australia, a fantastic win ahead of their meeting with France in Paris. The form of Matt Giteau will be of huge comfort to them, but the man himself is staying grounded.
"There's still a lot of things we can work on. The fact that we beat England by 14 points at Twickenham and we've still got improvements to make is a real positive for the boys," he said.
"Obviously England was a big win for us as far as the tour is concerned, but it means nothing if we go out and put in a bad performance against France."
Time: 03:42
Posted at 3:20 pm | 47 comments
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Viewing 47 comments
Anonymous November 17, 2008 3:07 pm
1st comment ha i remeber the tackle from the pic
Jonathan November 17, 2008 3:23 pm
The Aussies deserved their win. They have been playing together for a while and it showed. I am not too disheartened with England. They have injected some new blood into the team and there is hope there. Things will take time to gel. Remember Woodward was given 6 years to get it right. In the 97 autumn international we were thumped by NZ, and SA, drew in a poor game to Aus, and then got a 26-26 draw v. NZ in the final game....in the 99 World Cup we were a failure. Yet Woodward was given time and by 2003 we had won the cup. Just give Johnson time and things will turn. Very enetertaining game if a bit error filled. Giteau and Mortlock very impressive, but what's new?
ryebye November 17, 2008 3:25 pm
1st comment.. . .wow what alot you had to say for yourself lol. .. good game in all, from what was quite a inexperienced england team (im english) like johnson said Oz didnt really need to work hard to get there scores, at lest 4-5 times when they did get in the 22 england gave away stupid pens which is a little annoying as id have like to see how the defence would have work, ie could england turn them over and get the ball out the 22 and not just give away a pen and think 3's better then 7a few nice breaks by cips and nice to see that Armitage had another good game, cant say i thought much of noon (i never relised that both wingers,fullback and cipriani are all bigger then him)but then i dont really rate him id have like to have seen tate insteadall in all good win for OZ and not abad start for a younge england side i hope they only get better.
Anonymous November 17, 2008 3:33 pm
i think mortlock punished cipriani's defence everytime he ran at himbut cipriani offered a lot in attack decent game, and the result was fair
will66 November 17, 2008 4:04 pm
I'm with you jonathan - I think we just about have the right 15 on the park (although I'd like to see Tait at outside centre). All the players seem much happier under Johnson and I think once they stop committing rookie errors they'll be quite good.All credit to Australia - especially Stirling Mortlock. That guy is an awesome player and seems like a decent bloke too.
Kerivoula November 17, 2008 4:05 pm
All credit to the Aussies. They did a highly professional job. England made too many mistakes and were clinically punished for it.Borthwick needs to go, as does Vickery.Not wanting to ditract from the props, but it was Stephen Moore and Nathan Sharpe that made the difference. Can't take much out of the game apart from both teams are in transition, Aussies further along than England, and that the Aussies have a front five to compete with anybody's.
Anonymous November 17, 2008 5:40 pm
Sorry for anonymousYeh totally agree about Jamie Noon, complete waste at outside centre in an international team! I too would like to see Tait there but what the hell has he done going to Sale? Am I the only one who thinks this was a bad move for him? Rory Lamont is a good fullback, and McAlister (I don't know who the other centre is) seems to be keeping him out of thirteen. He's leagues ahead of Noon in terms of talent, just needs to exploit it.
Anonymous November 17, 2008 6:43 pm
Agree with most of what is being said. Apart from I think cipriani had a very below average performance, conpared to what should be done at test level. And maybe we shouldn't gp down the one way route we did with Wilkinson and consider other fly half's. If anything it could give cipriani the kick to perform in the way he has for Wasps
Anonymous November 17, 2008 8:25 pm
ha ha ha ha ha ha - British rugby - what a joke !! ha ha ha ha even when you do win - its through some ugly gorilla - heaps of skill - even Chris Latham for Worcester publicly acknowledges the standard of rugby is rubbish
Anonymous November 17, 2008 8:27 pm
smashed in the scrum by the "Wobblies" ????? ooooohhhhh - have england gotten worse or the Aussies gotten better ? You British will never admit either !! anyway .....game is over ....... and once again the natural order of world rugby has returned. to sum up - the English are crap and always have been. Danny Cipriani ?? what a joke
Harley November 17, 2008 8:33 pm
The better team won in the end.England need several things, in my opinion: Danny Care to stop running sideways, Flood to start vs the Boks or to play 12 in place of Flutey, Palmer and Vickery to be kept away from the pitch, and Tait in for Noon.That's the sort of youthful and potential-packed backline I want to see running in the red & white.
emilioz November 17, 2008 8:40 pm
hey dont you think that luke burguess played a very bad match?maybe cipriani has to play at 15.he is too young to have a team depending on him.PD:sorry for my english
felix November 17, 2008 9:01 pm
steve borthwick is rubbish - never let him play again. simon shaw has more talent in his little finger than borthwick has ever had. martin johnson must just dislike shaw. noon is just as bad as borthwick - he's supposed to be there for his 'defensive qualities'. i have never seen any evidence of these. he occasionally makes a big hit but is regularly completely out of position and always out of his depth. btw the hit in the picture so nearly went the other way. flutey really nearly bounced mortlock but stirlo just managed to hold it together and recover enough to gain the momentum and drive flutey backwards.
T November 17, 2008 9:23 pm
The soul reason Noon is there is because of his performance against Ireland in the six nations.Johnston obviously still thinks of that game when someone says Noon's name.To be fair to England, they are looking far more interesting then they have been in the past. Alot of moronic penalties, and Gitaeu is not the kind of kicker you want taking kicks against you anywhere in your 22.Cipriani... He was abit hit and miss. With Flutey outside him, you would think they would play better together. And Flutey didn't really 'turn on' until the last 10 minutes.Australia were good, but this new England team is dripping with potential. Just need to kick afew forwards the hell out of there, and bring Tait (even though he is an ass) into 13.If they make as big an improvment for the next game then the Bok's could be in for a good game.
will66 November 17, 2008 9:24 pm
A couple of inspired anonymous posts here. You guys are amazing. Daddy let you play with his computer huh? That's cute. RD - I thought we'd agreed to delete anonymous idiots like these?
DOOS November 17, 2008 9:35 pm
where the hell are the highlights from the SA vs SCOTLAND GAME!!!!???
Anonymous November 17, 2008 10:04 pm
hey will66 didnt you hear latham after they beat Sale the other day ? or just dont want to admit what we all know boring.....
Anonymous November 17, 2008 10:57 pm
before i post ill say that the better team did win on saturday. but things arent looking so bad for england as some people seem to thinkcips had a penalty and conversion miss which on another day hed probably have got, plus the crappy drop goal - if those had gone over thats 8 points extra to england and at the point australia were 7 points ahead, england would have been 1 ahead which could have made a huge difference. also cares silly decision for a quick tap when should have gone for the kick, could have been another 3 for england. on another day thats 11 extra points for england. would have still lost by 3 and the better team would still have won but people would be alot more optimistic about england if wed lost by 3 instead of 14. just goes to show the ruthless nature of international rugby and you need to take your chances when they come, which aus did to the max
Anonymous November 17, 2008 11:35 pm
I really wanted to see the Mortlock tackle!I like it more than the Wycliff Palu one.
robert November 18, 2008 12:31 am
I'm not an Aussie but Mortlock would be an early pick in any World XV I'd put together, not that the IRB is going to ask me anytime soon.For the posters who apologise for staying anonymous, if you click "Name/URL" you can just put any old name and you don't have to put a URL but at least it gives the rest of us a reference if we want to reply or agree etc. And you're still anonymous.I guarantee my real name is not robert.
Chris ash, syd Aust November 18, 2008 12:39 am
pitty mortlocks tackle wasnt in the replys - or did i miss it.deceiving that you used it as the promo image RD.
chris November 18, 2008 2:25 am
cipriani seems like a rocks or diamonds sort of player. england actually looked good with the ball in hand. but the most impressive thing from an australian point of view, is that we demolished the english scrum after all the talk about the past. not even the poms can say we didnt.
sean November 18, 2008 4:55 am
Great to see Australia beat England, it showed the english media that australia arent actually shit at scrummaging, were actually better, england under-estimated us and it showed. Sorry to the english that actually took this loss well, now you know how it feels.
vinniechan November 18, 2008 5:56 am
I have made this comment on countless post: the RFU decided to chronically ignore the fan's plead while buy into the idea from an outsider in no time. Farking Eddie Jones was the first one to suggest we plat Tait at 15, while he was one of the most exciting centres in the RWC.For any reasonable managers who would pick on form, Flood would have started for the whole series. Clearly, Jonno wants Cips to play regularly for England and that's the only reason he would give him maximum game time. But then this was his 3rd cap starting at 10 for England.
chris ash, syd Aust November 18, 2008 6:03 am
anon says: "Palu went high on Cipriani"chris says: "You're a fckn pussy!"
nick November 18, 2008 6:06 am
hahahahahah yeeeessss a sweet sweet win over the pommy's at their so called fortress, can't however beleive that they would boo there own team off the park, is that what the english call loyal support? ciprianni was actuly good - apart from kicking and i reckon he didi a better job then wilkinson - at least he can run the ball. CMON AUSSIE
Anonymous November 18, 2008 6:33 am
chris ash, he did go high just like very other islander
LYP November 18, 2008 10:10 am
I dont see how Latham has the balls to comment on British rugby after he got stepped by Gavin Henson, he's always been a joke of a full back.
billybob November 18, 2008 12:00 pm
So just cos england lost that means all british rugby is crap??.....australia are hardly world class at the moment
andy November 18, 2008 1:34 pm
RD thought you were going to be deleting all the prattish comments off here? Anyway dissapointing loss. I will say that Give Cips a chance as with experience he will be amazing. Give this team a year of playing together and we will be winning those games. Well done Aussies, taught us a lesson on how to win a test match, and well done your front row.
hackneygriffin November 18, 2008 2:02 pm
When England, and in particular Andrew Sheridan, did a number on Australia's scrum it was helped no end by the referee's failure to spot that Sheridan was not binding correctly onto his opposite man. On Saturday Jonker was clueless come scrum time and allowed Australia to negate the English front row by pulling the scrum down or standing up repeatedly. Had the Aussie front row been warned and penalised for failing to scrummage properly to begin with, the game, and in particular the scrums in the games later stages, would have been very diffierent. This is not to say that England would not have lost. They would have. But let's not get carried away with the renaissance of Australian scrummaging. It's about time all top flight refs had a strong knowledge of the workings of the front row and held international teams accountable when their front row fail to hold a scrum stable and straight.Johnson seems to have fallen foul of Andy Robinson's biggest mistake. In attempting to retain an experienced core to a team in a transitional period he is picking players who are not the best in their position now, let alone in 2011. Borthwick, Vickery, Noon, Easter - they need to go.
Jim November 18, 2008 2:10 pm
Palu's tackle was not high, was shoulder height. I think Martin Johnson will have another think about what he said. claiming that the ozzies were going to be an easier match up than the P.Is...As for Cipriani, showed good attacking skills, but just not up to it defensively. not for international standard anyway, even if its 107kg mortlock. should still at least go low... look at dan carter or matt giteau, not the biggest guys but still put in the tackles...
Cheyanqu November 18, 2008 2:34 pm
What really cracked me up this weekend is that Stu Dickinson awarded two penalty tries to Wales for Canada intentionally collapsing scrums.Apparently, he's the only Australian that has a concept of what intentionally collapsing a scrum is.That aside, I don't think it changes the outcome of this match.
ryebye November 18, 2008 3:00 pm
hackneygriffin I can not agree with you more about the scrums,lets not get me wronge the english scrums were not good enough and the ozzy did better in them. . . BUT and this is a big but the referring lacked consistency in the scrum throughout the game, at lest 3 times the scrum engaged and a ozzy props hand went stright to gound 1st time sheridan does it "whistle pen" .. . . .at times i though the ref didnt have a clue, he blew and id seen an infringement and though "great england pen, or oh crap another ozzy pen" just for it to go the other way. ..
G-man November 18, 2008 5:42 pm
I think this was a step forward for England despite the scoreline. To be honest, a year ago England would probably have won by playing boring and narrow rugby.Australia were deserved winners, but they hardly had to do anything fantastic to get the win. There were some really good moments fom England (quite a few bad ones too, but lets stay positive here) but our whole effort reeked of inexperience and a lack of composure at critical moments.So long as the england team get better this week, no matter what the result, I personally will be happy.Tait MUST be placed at outside centre though. Nothing came from the centres on saturday, it was disheartening to say the least.I personally would love to see Wilko at 12 and Tait at 13, that could be an outstanding centre partnership.And yes, Danny care just pass the ball out of the ruck for goodness sake (unless of course our back row want to start carrying around the fringes...)
Anonymous November 18, 2008 7:12 pm
henson is one of my favourite players but saying chris latham is a joke of a fullback is outrageous!!....latham is one of the best if not thee best fullback ever
Matt_Drinks_New November 18, 2008 8:46 pm
I think everyone just needs to calm down a wee bit...Aussies won the match, deservedly.The scrum penalties were legitimate (if you saw the scrum before the Mortlock penalty you'd understand which pack was superior on the day). Cipriani looked good, very dangerous with ball in hand, unfortunately not so much at foot. Palu tackle was not too high, and Riki Flutie will think twice about running at the Evil Wizard in future. Not the world's best exhibition for rugby, but both teams have a lot more talent than showed.
DC November 18, 2008 11:23 pm
g-man i agree tait would be best at outside centre but wilko definitely wouldnt be our best choice at inside. why? 1. he s too slow - opposition will spot gaps in defence, esp if he has to help cover cipriani's channel.2. he s not big enough/or conversely fast/agile enough to offer a real attacking threat to most international inside centres. but i do think we need to move away from a more defensively minded approach and concentrate on attacking. with the amount of possession we had, THE BACKS not just the forwards should have got something
Anonymous November 19, 2008 9:31 am
luke burgess is a joke and he passes like an U-12 player. Y not sam cordinlly
matt n November 19, 2008 4:30 pm
DCactually if you watch videos of jonny when hes training hes actually one of the quicker fly halves in WR, hes pretty agile too.
Jim November 19, 2008 11:47 pm
I find it interesting that after reading the comments that the English were very complimentary of the Aussies and said that the australia deserved to win, and opposing the good sportsmanship of the english fans are a bunch of people slandering the english. this is from a neutral spectator who, just wanted to say it was a quality match, unfortunatly the some assie fans cant match the quality and respect shown by their own team.
cliff November 20, 2008 9:13 am
LYP is a complete idiot Lathem a joke of a full back haha goo back to bed sunshine
Anonymous November 20, 2008 10:35 am
sean said...it showed the english media that australia arent actually shit at scrummaging, were actually better, england under-estimated us and it _______________________________i fail to agree some really bad calls by the ref, and were the touch judges watching the scrums at all?
Fredrik enstad November 20, 2008 10:38 am
I think England need jonny wilkinson cipriani is too overrated, when jonny is gone i think toby flood should play for his experiance and that is what england needs so I really think that martin should rethink about cipriani.
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