Chris Jack scores within a minute on Western Province debut

first:P
lol,
wow he's big:P!

second, great lock try, that's how they must be

For someone who claims that NH rugby is 'easy', that was pretty awful.

Kearney m8 what is your problem didnt get enough tension as a child? that had nothing to do with defense you moron it was the kickers fault same mistake cipriani made and a try got scored off. you are a belend moron.

great charge down from a big man. nice to see the try go to chris jack in my mind hes always been a role model to look up to in terms of attitude in playing the game.

wouldnt ya hate to be that scrum half:D

fair play to the big man is pretty fast as well

What is it with the knee into the ribs or back when going over for a try?
Simon Shaw got carded for it out field in SA for the Lions recently.

Here as usual, no one bats an eyelid when the knees go in in the try scoring moment.

How do ppl get away with it ppl?

he had some monstrous moments at the breakdown as well. one of the best in the game imo :)

mise,

I absolutely agree! I think shaw's was a combination of bad refereeing and judgement when he got suspended. If it had happened when someone was diving for a try no one would have thought twice.

Great, great player (and without any ego it seems) - WP must be so pleased to have him.

Good luck to him. If I were Graham Henry/an AN supporter I would want him back for 2011........

might be a dumb question, but why is he not playing in NZ??

to the anonymous a few comments above, new zealand vs. france first test ring any bells? im irish but i hate it when people consider the NH as just the eng, wales, scot and ire.

grammar in that last comment wasnt great, but you get what i mean. i predict world cup 2011 will be a more even NH/SH balance in the final rounds than 2007

Instructions for all of you MORONS who post as Anonymous:

1.) Look below the "Choose an identity" at the 4 little cicles (a.ka.a radio buttons)

2.) Select Name/URL (I will keep it simple for you SH lads;thats the 3r one down,keep with me, it gets easier!)
3.) Once you have located this, click the circle and a "Name" field becomes available.
4.) Write in your name.
5.) Click the "Publish Your Comment" button
( Now we will probably see loads of MORONS with "YOUR NAME" instead of Anonymous but sure you cant blame me for trying...

Saracens have a 'connection' of some sort with Western Province, so he got the opportunity like that apparently.

I wouldnt say no to an offer of playing in Cape Town. Sure beats London or Christchurch imo.

Anonym - 2:20am

NH rugby is much better than SH rugby, even Matfeild said that the rugby was better up here. The Lions only lost to SA because of some silly penalties, i think that you know that if they played SA again they would hump them. NH rugby can be slower than SH rugby, that's because the defense is so good. NZ and AUS are probably the best 2 teams in the world, but SA are not!!

Ha ArranR, good luck with that argument. Just look at the stats for SH teams, I can't believe you can say that NH rugby is better. How many games did SH teams lose in the NH tour last year? Aussie lost 1 and Argentina lost 1, how can you say NH defence is better? Which team scored a try against the All Backs? How diluted are the NH club tournaments as well, look at guys like Glen Jackson, Riki Flutey, Doug Howlett, Carl Hayman, Nick Evans, Aaron Mauger, Ben Blair, Xavier Rush, Byron Kelleher... where do they come from?

might sound like a stuiped question but what is currie cup?? is it just another cup for super 14 teams or is it below super 14??

@geoff: as shaft said, sarries have some connections to cape town. and apart from that, jack wanted to play at a higher level - for both his own fund ando for his skills to (re-)improve, thinking of the AB jersey he wants to retain.
the gap between the super 14 and the domestic competition is a wee bit bigger in NZ compared to SA (i say that as a NZ supporter), so it seems quite logical to go to a SA team. i warship him as a player and i hope he'll be back with the crusaders for next year. even though this would be a tough battle for the starting spots, with thorn and ross both having huge seasons for the saders and the ABs.
anyways, good to see him in the curry cup. he'll have a huge impact, that's for sure :)

oops, sry for the bad spelling :D

The Currie Cup is South Africa's domestic competition. It's like the Top 14 for France, Guinness Premiership for England, Air NZ Cup for NZ.. etc.

Before the Super 10/12/14 came along, it was the biggest thing in south african rugby. Obviously now with Super rugby, which includes two other countries, it is technically 'below' that competition. But the intensity and rivalry is just as good.

Great to have a player of the calibre of Jack playing CC rugby. Was awesome to see Freddie Michalak last year.

Sireli Naquelivuki (Fijian star) also scored for Province on the day by the way.

If Kockott box kicked immediately without taking the extra step, he would have cleared the ball. :(

^ how stupid are you to waste your time looking up facts to try to sound smart, but then cant even leave a name, instead posting as Anonymous??

RD, delete it please, thanks. :)

Use a name chaps - Anonymous comments get randomly deleted, especially if they're against the site guidelines.

I am a WP fan, but Ricky January is such a fat little s**t. Look how he goes and shoves Rory Kockot after the charge-down. He is forever trying to pick fights after his own team has scored.

Surely here in the Cape we can produce better scrummies? His defence still is robust, but his kicking and passing game has gone down the tubes.

"Look how he goes and shoves Rory Kockot after the charge-down. He is forever trying to pick fights after his own team has scored."

Andy-Stinky, grammatically speaking, I think you are referrring to Kockott. And incidentally, the comment would historically be more appropriate to refer to Kockott than Januarie.

Kockott starts more sh** than a bowl of vindaloo

it was just so obvious he was gonna get cherged down, he shouldnt have taken the extra step

chris jack is only playing currie cup in sa, after that he shuld be able to return to nz for the super14 and stay there til 2011

hate the way janurie shouts in kockott's face when jack scores.

little faaaag. go rory go

To anonymous

Without having to spend hours or days to find statistics to make a non valid point as to why Chris Jack would rather play rugby in Cape Town then London or Christchurch I just read todays news paper and wish to point you to the following website.

www.travelandleisure.com

Top 10 Cities Overall

Rank Name Score
1 Udaipur, India 87.94
2 Cape Town 87.69
3 Bangkok 86.80
4 Buenos Aires 86.22
5 Chiang Mai , Thailand 86.1
6 Florence 85.61
7 Luang Prabang , Laos 85.45
8 New York 84.65
9 Rome 84.63
10 San Francisco 84.53

Say no more

"Ha ArranR, good luck with that argument. Just look at the stats for SH teams, I can't believe you can say that NH rugby is better. How many games did SH teams lose in the NH tour last year? Aussie lost 1 and Argentina lost 1, how can you say NH defence is better? Which team scored a try against the All Backs? How diluted are the NH club tournaments as well, look at guys like Glen Jackson, Riki Flutey, Doug Howlett, Carl Hayman, Nick Evans, Aaron Mauger, Ben Blair, Xavier Rush, Byron Kelleher... where do they come from?"

plenty of players have gone int he opposite direction, but recent rulings on non eligabiltiyt by the home unions have restricted that.

on top of that using the SH national teams as a bench mark for domestic competition quality is pointless, you're talking about the concentration fo the best players out of a nation, that dosen't necessarily have any bearing on domestic competition.

also bear in mind that the GP Has 12 teams alone, the french championships obviously 14 in the top tier. magners 12, thats 38 teams playing top class rugby compared to 14.

the concentraion of players and their exposure in super 14's is far greater so it's not unreasonable to bring in outside players.

As for statistically sound defenders how can a team win a cup final by 60 points and that competition be deemed defensive sound?

The Heineken cup is far more intense then the super 14, sorry but that's how it is, hence people like carter etc... coming here to play in the premier club based competition in the world.

It's also far more financially solvent then super rugby hence they get the big fat paychecks to play.

Dose that make it better? not really, it just makes it different.

As for Jack wanting to go back to WP to improve his skills etc... he was released before he got picked up, his comments about NH rugby are just sour grapes as Saracens thought him surplus to requirement.

No 10 do you really believe all that?
Do you really think Carter went to France for the quality of rugby? Or maybe, just maybe, he wanted to earn about three times his wages for a single season of rugby in southern France.
Players from the south don't go north for great rugby, they go for the extra zeroes on their paychecks.
Which is fair enough, and has no doubt increased the quality and standard of European club rugby.
Club rugby in Europe is going great, the money in it alone is amazing. The standard is very good at the top level these days, and there are many good players running around up there.
The S14 though concentrates all of the best players from the countries which consistently produce the best players and national teams in the world into just 5 teams each for SA and NZ and 4 for Aus.
The Bulls are not far from the South African national team in terms of quality and experience, for example. They are very good teams.
Take the Cheetahs for example, a weakened version of this team, who finished last in the S14, gave the Lions a very good run for their money not long ago.
The S14 is of a very, very high standard, and still consistently produces the best three national teams in the world who draw all of their players from the competition. Remember Botha, Matfield and Smit taking it to the Lions? They play the same way for their S14 provinces.
Anyway, so what if Chris Jack plays for WP, good on him. As a rugby player I'd think it would be an honor to play in the Currie Cup.

Oh, and that was me, since everyone's obsessed with names.

The strongest national teams of all the sports you've mentioned select players from the best domestic comps in the world.
The same is true of rugby.
The top three countries in rugby only select players from one competition, the S14. It is simple logic that this must be one of the strongest competitions in rugby.
Probably the strongest.
Where do you think Brussouw came from? The T14 or Guiness premiership? Afraid not.

Jon no offense my friend but you're not really getting my point.

A National side can be strong despite it's domestic competition. Look at argentina for a great example of a weak domestic league and strong national side, because their best players exceed the domsetic competition.

Obviously we wont agree on which is the beter hemisphere. The only way to decide which hemisphere is beter is to compile a team from the NH and the SH and let them do their thing on the field. Hopefully that will stop all the bitching from people that never played the best game ever invented. But seeing that it will not happen in our life time we should just all agree that the southern hemisphere is the best in all major sports. So call us third world if you like this makes the shame of losing against us even worse.

Chris jack is only in wp just for the 09 curry cup then he has signed up for new zealand till 2011 and playing super rugby next year for the crusaders

goodnumber10, I do get your point mate.
But the reason Argentina has such a strong national rugby team, is that their players play in one of the top domestic comps, the T14.
I don't dispute the fact that the European leagues are of a very high standard, with all the money involved in them, how could they not be?
However, clearly the S14 is also one of the top leagues in the world. Every player who played for SA (and won) in that Lions series plays S14 rugby. Every single All Black who got the grand slam last year without conceding a try, plays S14 rugby. Every single wallaby who came within four points of the tri-nations and beat England and France last year plays S14 rugby.
Obviously if the league is producing these players consistently, and the coaches who manage the national teams, it is of a very, very high standard.
It's not like Bathies Botha and Victor Matfield play differently for the Bulls as they do for SA. They play exactly the same way in the S14, all the SA players do. You know, the same forward pack that beat the Lions are all S14 players. Nonu runs just as hard for the Hurricanes, Gitaeu is just as mesmerising for the Force.
I don't know how else to illustrate it to you.
I mean where do you think Brussouw or O'Conner learned their rugby? In Europe?
Where do you think Elsom, Howlett or Butch James learned their rugby?
The answer is of course the S14.
So this European sense of superiority bemuses me, and seems almost like desperate posturing to cover up the deficiancies of the European national teams.
And in reply to the guy going on about the economics of the S14, go back to school and learn about basic market forces, then we'll talk.

Oh, and that was me.

i don't think there is anyone saying the Europeans are superior, lets maintina focus this did come form someone commenting on chris jack saying the European rugby was weaker and slower.

No doubt super rugby is a very high top level, but it's not as intense as Henieken cup rugby, which is widely accepted as the most competitive Club/Provinical rugby tournament in the world.

I don't think the super 14 necessarily produces better players, i think the national age group set ups do that, look how dominant NZ & SA are in youth rugby and then look how many of them translate that to senior rugby.

I think thats the differnce in the hemispheres, the age group set ups for the respective countries.

France, NZ, England and SA are frequently the most competitive countries at age group rugby, and most frequently translate that to international level senior rugby.

oh, and jon, i'd just like to say i totally respect super 14's it's a great tournament with some outstanding teams and players and as a rugby fan i love watching it.

I just don't think it's the pinnacle of non international rugby people make it out to be.

Some nice biased editing going on again here, not hard to tell which part of the world the webmaster is from.

Goodnumber10, we'll have to agree to disagree about the HC.
A very high standard, certainly, but impossible to say it's more intense than S14.
Too subjective mate, I personally don't think it's any more intense than playing the Bulls at Loftus or trying to get past a full strength Crusaders side in Canterbury. But how can I show that to you?
Certianly the most intense player in last years HC final was Rocky Elsom, who played week in week out the same way for the Tahs. That ferocious tackling and running is just as prevelant down south.
The main difference, IMO, is the ambition of SH teams. Just a little more enterprise and a little more belief in their ability to play expansive rugby.
Anyway, we could argue forever and never know who's right.
I have no problem with saying that European rugby is going great, and is of a very high standard.
I am bemused by comments about the physicality of S14 rugby or comments about soft defence. To my mind it's absurd.
Elsom is just as intense down south as he was up north, it's just he is off your radar down here.
Same way most southerners have no idea about Eruo club rugby, hence the lack of respect.

Jon all fair comments, and obviously it's a subjective matter.

All i'd say is if we are going to sue the development of individual players as examples of the strength of a domestic league look at people like BOD, Simon Shaw, Laurence Dallaglio, Martin Johnson, Tom Croft and so on...

Some of those players, the Johnson Dallaglio era were developed under British system in place when the super 14 was considered to be superior and in the ascendancy.

Thats before i even start on the french and guys Like Dussatoir, Heymans, Szarzewski, Medard, Jauzion and so on.

All systems throw up great players, but the overall standard of domsetic competition is just not as high in SH at the moment compared to Europe.

I mean looking at super 14, how many teams could conceivably have won last year? I mean really? it was pretty much a two horse race, compare that to GP, Heni cup and Top 14 where it was undecided until the champions were crowned.

It's just far more competitive that's all. in my opinion obviously.

anyway, like you said could go on for days discussing this, great points, interesting discussion.

I think we can both accept that both SH & NH competition produces some great playersand some great matches.

More than two teams could have won it mate, the sharks, bulls, waratahs, crusaders and hurricanes all had a realistic chance on paper.
But anyway, it's all good, as you say we'll never agree on everything.

Boring. This argument will never be won or lost, everyone thinks their hemisphere is better. Naturally. Anyway, i think NH rugby is 100 times better to watch.

andy, you say it's boring, and then give your opinion on it.
get ####