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Saturday, November 12, 2011

Ryan Lamb calls for TMO after high flying penalty

Here's a quick look at what happened in a recent Aviva Premiership game when Northampton Saints' Ryan Lamb kicked what he thought was a successful penalty. The TMO was called into play, but even then, the result of the kick was inconclusive.

In the World Cup we saw an incident in the Sprinboks vs Wales pool game when James Hook kicked a penalty that he was adamant had gone over. It was ruled otherwise at the time, and there was no referral to the Television Match Official, which outraged Welsh fans following the loss.

In that occasion it wasn't clear that it had gone over, even on TV, but there was still a huge amount of controversy simply because the TMO wasn't called into action. Fast forward two months and Lamb's kick for Saints showed that even when calling for the fourth official, the correct decision is not certain.

In this case the benefit of the doubt went with the referees on the field, who thought it missed. Lamb was certain it swung in, but TV replays weren't clear as the bright background of the sky and a few poor angles meant we were none the wiser. The solution? Double the length of the posts.

In the real world, endangering low flying aircrafts isn't the way forward. This is probably just one of those things we can't control. On most occasions the guys below the posts, and the ref, should have the best view. When things are questioned or the officials are unsure, a call to the TMO is the correct one. At times we'll get a situation like this, but it's a rarity thankfully, and until someone comes up with a hawkeye for the posts, life goes on.

Some of you wanted to see this again, so while it's possibly one of the most boring clips ever posted on here, it is an interesting one that is fairly topical, following the Hook incident and then the kick from Stephen Donald in the RWC Final, that some still think missed.

Posted by Rugbydump at 2:34 pm | View Comments (19)

Posted in See it to Believe it

Viewing 19 comments

RedYeti November 12, 2011 5:28 pm

It can't be that difficult or expensive to use similar 'Hawkeye' technology to tennis to keep track of the ball. Would also make it a lot easier for the TMO to judge whether or not the ball had crossed the tryline/touch and could even be used to determine grounding. This is a professional sport now, and we need to take advantage of professional technology

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medicaluke November 12, 2011 5:31 pm

I've always wondered this. Especially how tennis has the technology to be able to determine if the ball hits the line with some very fine degrees of accuracy and its almost immediately. I don't think the IRB are emulating what FIFA have been doing for years and denying the need for advanced technology, so it would be interesting to see a hawkeye system be trialled. Especially in a stadium that has really short posts.

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medicaluke November 12, 2011 5:29 pm

I loved the shot of the white sky...perfect to tell whether the ball went over or not. Really really bad camera angles for the TMO to deal with.
Its always nice to see a ref go to the TMO though at the player's request

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phunni November 12, 2011 6:34 pm

It looked to me like it went over the posts which, I believe, the laws say is good.

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WelshOsprey November 12, 2011 8:33 pm

Good ref atleast he checked with the TMO

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Citing Commissioner November 12, 2011 8:45 pm

Why is all this talk necessary, just listen to the touch judges. If two of them, and the referee, cannot come to an answer then the IRB should spend any money they would on a hawkeye project on improving their referees instead.

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Just Call Me Ehtch November 12, 2011 9:24 pm

Never mind about that english nonse Ryan Lamb, how about the three La France teams sent packing and being slaughtered by us taffies this weekend? La France, get on your bikes,


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stroudos November 13, 2011 10:13 am

I'm seriously struggling to understand a word of your posts, but thanks for posting the Joe Ajuwa link - bloke is 'king amazing, (I mean some of this is against quite weak oppo but some isn't!). Don't get how I'd never heard of him before... Does he still play for Scarlets?

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Just Call Me Ehtch November 15, 2011 6:52 am

Yes, thought so, stroudos, Joe Ajuwa is plying his trade at London Welsh these days,

and Orchard7, AKA Rob Appleyard, who made that vid, is a coach at Newport-Gwent Dragons these days,

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Hendogo November 12, 2011 11:40 pm

Heaven forbid that we copy American Football, and make the post yellow, so we can easily see, if the (white) ball goes over the post. All I'm saying is if we make the post a different color than the ball, it would make it much simpler to tell if it's good or not.

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pilapica November 13, 2011 5:40 am

how about we add a net?

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Guy November 13, 2011 9:15 am

Why don't we put in a minimum length of 60 meter for the posts?

If two touch judges and the ref think it's a miss, you can be pretty sure it's a miss. Besides: we're only in the tenth minute of the match or something. Seems to me there will be plenty more opportunity to score some points...

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stroudos November 13, 2011 10:07 am

What I don't get is why kickers feel like they have to smash it so hard/high every time. Bloody people are always kicking balls right over the roof at Adams Park and it looks completely unnecessary to me.
If you're 15m out why not just nudge it gently between the uprights???
I don't believe it's easier to hit it accurately the harder you hit. That wouldn't make sense. If you're playing golf, you don't take your driver out for a little chip up to the green.

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Just Call Me Ehtch November 13, 2011 10:58 am

Just build the posts taller, reaching the moon, I say. That could be a solution...

And by the way Strudos, I am now officially registered here like you, but see how long I last, oh yes sir....

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Tex15 November 15, 2011 1:09 am

As a kicker myself the reason they hit it that hard from short distances is kicking is all to do with timing and rythym. If you tried to kick it softer it would mess that up. That is why you often see kicks from greater distances miss, not cause the distance is too far, but because the timing changes when you try and kick it harder (or softer)

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beerholder November 13, 2011 12:20 pm

I like the idea of lasers :D

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Just Call Me Ehtch November 15, 2011 7:12 am

Scarlets v. Castres from Saturday afternoon lack of coverage question - S4C CLIC has highlights at this link. BUT, sorry, UK only, but if video capture pirates in UK could put it on youtube, that is if ERC and S4C don't mind....
About half an hour in here, and a chance to catch up on your Welsh language lessons, my english friends....

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Just Call Me Ehtch November 15, 2011 7:41 am

Some could ask why Sean Lamont enjoys playing for the Scarlets. All I have to say is visit Carter's Bar, on the border of Scotland/Northumbria-England border, and read the plaque there. It is in Welsh from old times, when it was Wales, believe it or not - the north country - pobl o'r hen gogledd. Reivers and all that later. Now I am not saying the Lamonts were cattle and sheep rustlers in old...
end of distant history lesson.

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gnoballib November 20, 2011 7:40 pm

It should be a miss , I attended a refereeing course and I learned that when a ball goes over the vertical posts it should be counted as a miss . The reason is that if the posts hight was infanite the ball would have hit the posts . Chances are small that he ball would bounce through the posts , but would rather have been missed .

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