Tuesday Apr 10, 2018

TEN reset scrums in ten minutes leads to Tigers try

TEN reset scrums in ten minutes leads to Tigers try
16
Comments

There were strange scenes at Twickenham on Saturday as Adam Thompstone crossed the line for Leicester Tigers, but only after ten reset scrums in nearly ten minutes of play against Bath.

It was certainly one for the rugby purists as Kahn Fotuali’i was penalised for killing the ball on his own five-metre line, with Tigers opting to scrum down after a dominant first 20 minutes.

What came next can only be described as once-a-season. With the scrum constantly going down, Bath were penalised five times and eventually referee Wayne Barnes issued a yellow to tight head Shaun Knight, adding to Fotuali’i’s yellow.

Tigers continued to scrum and finally it held out in the tenth attempt and winger Thompstone was able to slide into the corner.

Two tries from Sione Kalamafoni and one apiece from Sam Harrison and Telusa Veainu added to Thompstone’s effort to take Leicester to third in the Aviva Premiership, after the 34-19 victory. Bath’s hopes of reaching the playoffs seem all but over as they sit in eighth.

According to Leicester Tiger’s Twitter account there were ten scrums in nine minutes and 43 seconds of play, and they’ve managed to cram it in to a two minute video below.

Do you think Wayne Barnes should have issued a penalty try when Knight was given his yellow?

16 Comments

  •  weejockmcplop
    weejockmcplop

    Problem with this, and haven't checked all of the preceding scrums, in the last scrum that leads to the try the Leicester tighthead's hips are angled out and he is not driving straight. This has allowed him to drive over the top of the Bath loosehead effectively removing him from the scrum and de-powering Bath's scrum. There are several penalties against the Leisceter prop here but Wayne is on the wrong side to see this and would need his touch judge, who s too far away, to pick this up. Dave Rennie (Glasgow coach) has gone on the record this season as saying that the way props are allowed to drive at angle in scrums is wrong and creates a lottery for teams to defend. There really needs to be a re-think of how scrums laws are applied as 10 minutes of resets is very poor fare for anybody's ticket!

    Reply
  •  drg
    drg

    It's such a difficult one because as someone mentioned, what if you have a really dominant scrum, but a bit of a weak lineout.. being forced to have a lineout because the other team can't handle your scrum pressure is wrong... But the alternative is what we see now I suppose.. Good point below about amateaur scrums. They do collapse sure, but you might get 2-4 per game maybe - and some of those can probably be attributed to amateur pitches, rather than a couple resets per SCRUM, in the pro game..

    Reply
  •  larry
    larry

    Well, lineouts within the five meter zone might be allowed again. A good kicker kicking to touch after his team has been awarded a penalty for another collapsed scrum could mean a cheap try with a lineout within a meter or two of the goal line. Think about that! What prop wants to be responsible for giving up a penalty for collapsing a scrum that leads to a cheap try from a lineout near his own goal, nearer than five meters?

    Reply
  •  larry
    larry

    Good look at the problem, as usual. What to do? It would fundamentally change the game to do away with scrums. Teams have that option, if a penalty is given, to take another scrum. Make them play the ball? Have lineouts again within five meters of the goal line? I mean, if that old law came back, and a team was defensively collapsing, it would mean a kick to touch to near the goal line would allow for a lineout near the goal line again. So, that might mean a cheap try given away. That might make a prop think twice about causing a collapse to mess up the attacking side's put in!

    Reply
  •  larry
    larry

    The issue of scrums seems to exist only at the top levels of the game. I've seen plenty of rugby games at lower levels, and the hijinks between front rows don't occur. The less likely one is being paid to play, or the less one is being paid to play, the less likely scrum collapses, resets, etc. I played at a time when referees didn't set scrums. Funny, but it seems less crap went on then. Scrums set up, met head on, and the game went on. Sure, there were collapses now and then, but it seems the intent to fix scrums with the referee setting them has only made things worse, at the top levels of the game.

    Reply
  •  10stonenumber10
    10stonenumber10

    Did you see that ludicrous display last night? The problem with Leicester... is that they always try and walk the ball over the line.

    Reply
  •  dancarter
    dancarter

    Their front row is pretty impressive mind, and while scrum dominance isn't as valuable as it once was it's still an advantage. I think they haven't invested enough in the second row and back row, and they traded their best 2nd row, Slater, to Gloucester for May. I wouldn't have signed Ford either, I think as a set of fly-halves Burns and Williams are better than George and Joe Ford, plus George Ford is away on international duty.

    Reply
  •  colombes
    colombes

    Only ten minutes of reset? Com'on Wayne, you can do better. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uF36pmWdWus

    Reply
  •  drg
    drg

    I don't know what the answer is overall. Also, because I didn't see this game and the video is so high speed (which is fine because I'd imagine it's somewhat dull) it's hard to determine what the reason behind each reset is.. Barnes seems to be pointing left and right each time, so I can only assume the reasons behind each reset were different - a bit like that debacle with France in last years 6N. Think of the numerous reasons for a reset: - prop loses footing - prop loses binding - early engagement - front rows too close - front rows not close enough - front rows head on head - ground gives way - so scrum gets reset left or right - both front rows go down - unstable scrums There are so many reasons, some have someone at fault, others are just "one of those things, let's reset". With this video I don't know if there should have been a penalty try or something sooner, but IF referees hands are tied to only punishing consecutive indescretions, then maybe that's where the answer lies. It's generally practiced on other parts of the field in groupings of slowing the ball down - not rolling away, hands in the ruck, etc.

    Reply
  •  jimmy23
    jimmy23

    If it looks like the defending team are doing it on purpose then penalise them. Or after 2 resets the attacking team gets to tap it once the defending team has gone back 10. Anything is better than sitting through 10 minutes of resetting scrums.

    Reply
  •  im1
    im1

    what happens if the defending team have a crap scrum and the attacking team have a crap lineout. The defending team just collapse the the scrum twice to get it moved to a lineout

    Reply
  •  jimmy23
    jimmy23

    I honestly think there needs to be a limit to the amount of resets. Maybe this is a mental idea but say after a maximum 2 resets on the same scrum it gets moved to a lineout? It's still a set piece and the attacking team doesn't lose field position.

    Reply
  •  im1
    im1

    What would happen to the game if we stopped giving penalties for scrum offences and just gave free kicks? It would still be important to have props who can scrummage because you could still get a dominant scrum giving the team strong front foot ball. Or would it just end up with the weaker scrum just collapsing it everytime? If that is the case, what about for every intentional scrum collapse the next scrum is 5 meters closer to the offenders try line?

    Reply
  •  im1
    im1

    its a fair point though.... ignoring the comparison, do Tigers actually think they can compete with Exeter or Sarries? Or are they just happy to get into the play-offs?

    Reply
  •  drg
    drg

    What is this arsenal F.C you speak of? F.C - fish n chips? I can only assume it's some unfortunate typo and that you've not tainted these white pages with your heathenist foosball comparison bile...

    Reply
  •  45678
    45678

    Tigers have become the arsenal F.C. of rugby - failing to evolve, persistent with a stubborn logic that their way is best whilst celebrating finishing in the top four as an achievement. I like an old school dominant scrum and forward performance, but times have changed. Beating up a weakened bath front row merely masks over the huge faults that persist post cockerill. They are still without a plan b. Once forward dominance is lost against better sides like saracens and Exeter, they still look lost

    Reply

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TEN reset scrums in ten minutes leads to Tigers try | RugbyDump - Rugby News & Videos